Engine quit while traveling

ponydrvr

Member
My doctor finally released me to ride locally last week. I haven't ridden since May 29th so I was more than ready to go. Then I couldn't! My CTX just died about a mile from the house. Had my son pickup my truck and trailer to get it home.

The dreaded "STUCK IN GEAR" thing finally happened to me yesterday. I just now resolved the issue.

The symptoms:
  • engine stops while traveling down highway.
  • transmission disengaged from engine
  • engine will not restart
  • front panel indicates to be in neutral

The inspections:
  • checked battery voltage - 13.0vdc - Good
  • checked the 30A main fuse - Good
  • checked the 15A sub fuse - the start of the starter circuit - Good
  • checked the starter relay per manual
  • checked the starter circuit through the Kill/Run switch and through the START PB (per manual) - Good
  • checked the starter control relay - removed from fuse block - Good
  • checked the kickstand switch - per manual - Good
  • turned ignition key on to listen - lots of clunking going on - BAD
  • Fuel pump pressured up - Good
  • panel shift indicator showed 6th gear - BAD

The fix:
  • The clunking was the linear relays searching for Neutral
  • With the ignition switch on and the bike on the center stand:
    clunking begins anew, rolled the rear wheel backwards slowly,
    (it was down shifting) stopped momentarily between each shift, continued until shifting stopped.
  • pressed the start button and the engine came to life.

WOOP WOOP now I can ride again!
 

Steven

Member
Apparently you're good at trouble shooting considering that the problem wasn't even in the manual.

I'm curious though, what has the gear shifting have to do with the bike dying? It seems apparent that the wheel has to be turning for the bike to shift gears, that sort of makes sense since it's electronic.. I'm grabbing for straws, but I wonder if the wheel sensor has anything to do with it. I'm thinking that if the sensor quit sending information to the computer, the bike thinks it's stopped and since the gear changes are speed sensitive it didn't know what to do being that the bike was in (I assume) 6th gear and the wheel was reporting 0 mph. That's probably not it, it's just a thought.

Perhaps a way to test this is to go down the road in a higher gear, hit the kill switch and come to a stop. Then reengage the kill switch and try to restart the engine. I don't know if the engine downshifts when the kill switch is engaged so this might be a waste of time.

Starting on page 12-11 of the manual to page 12-15, there are a host of reasons the gear shift will not work. Some of these state that the engine will not work and the bike won't shift.

I don't think I've ever heard anyone say this has happened more than once, so maybe there's nothing to worry about.

On that note... Welcome back to the streets of Kentucky! Ride on and enjoy the rest of the good riding weather.
 

Merlin III

New member
My doctor finally released me to ride locally last week. I haven't ridden since May 29th so I was more than ready to go. Then I couldn't! My CTX just died about a mile from the house. Had my son pickup my truck and trailer to get it home.

The dreaded "STUCK IN GEAR" thing finally happened to me yesterday. I just now resolved the issue.

The symptoms:
  • engine stops while traveling down highway.
  • transmission disengaged from engine
  • engine will not restart
  • front panel indicates to be in neutral

The inspections:
  • checked battery voltage - 13.0vdc - Good
  • checked the 30A main fuse - Good
  • checked the 15A sub fuse - the start of the starter circuit - Good
  • checked the starter relay per manual
  • checked the starter circuit through the Kill/Run switch and through the START PB (per manual) - Good
  • checked the starter control relay - removed from fuse block - Good
  • checked the kickstand switch - per manual - Good
  • turned ignition key on to listen - lots of clunking going on - BAD
  • Fuel pump pressured up - Good
  • panel shift indicator showed 6th gear - BAD

The fix:
  • The clunking was the linear relays searching for Neutral
  • With the ignition switch on and the bike on the center stand:
    clunking begins anew, rolled the rear wheel backwards slowly,
    (it was down shifting) stopped momentarily between each shift, continued until shifting stopped.
  • pressed the start button and the engine came to life.

WOOP WOOP now I can ride again!
There have been more than a few reports similar to yours of the bike dying and not restarting, or the engine dying and being stuck stuck in 6th gear. Sounds to me like a computer problem. Your solution sounds good. Could you tell me why you turned the rear wheel in reverse versus forward? Also, what mode were you in when this happened?
 
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ponydrvr

Member
To answer both your questions.


  • I forgot to mention that in troubleshooting this issue I discovered that the resistance from the negative battery lead to the chassis was not as low as I thought it should be on several of the common ground lines. So I pulled all the covers off and went to each of the individual ground points. I discovered two that were loose, the rest were really tight, the two that I had been using were also still tight. Each of the common grounds now have less than 0.100 ohms resistance, before it was 2.5 to 4 ohms.



  • With that information and knowing that the ground circuit was likely the root cause of the failure to start. It is my understanding that the loose grounds were erratic and causing the PCM to go into critical fault and lock out he start circuit. As for why it stopped in 6th gear; I can only guess the erratic nature caused it to shift from 4th to 6th for some reason. I am not certain that locking into 6th gear is really meaningful information. The fact that the clutches were not engaged while the transmission was more meaningful indicating the PCM and mechanics system were out of sync.



  • Turning the wheel in reverse seemed to permit the downshift to occur. Going forward didn't do anything to stop the clunking.

I don't know how to respond to the other conjectures. There may be other causes, but without looking at the other problems I wouldn't offer any opinion.

What is sort of confusing to me is why this issue took so long to develop?

Oh well! It is fixed now and I rode about 60 miles this evening to just "test it out". It sure felt good to be back in the saddle again. And this time everything worked perfectly.
 

Downshifter

New member
I have been on the road when the kill switch was accidentally engaged. (lets not get into how lol). I was able to reset the the kill switch, turn the key off and back on, and the bike restarted with no problem. I was able to do this while still rolling...

Jim.....
 

Merlin III

New member
An electrical connection or electrical power issue has always been a common theme lurking in the background of all the discussions I have read on this issue. This thread is by far the most revealing because the incident happened to someone who had the knowledge and experience to trouble shoot the problem on the spot. In many of the threads on this subject, the owner took the bike to the dealer for repair and days later the dealer was able to start the bike right up and couldn't find any problems with anything? How would time correct a resistance issue?

I forgot to mention that in troubleshooting this issue I discovered that the resistance from the negative battery lead to the chassis was not as low as I thought it should be on several of the common ground lines. So I pulled all the covers off and went to each of the individual ground points. I discovered two that were loose, the rest were really tight, the two that I had been using were also still tight. Each of the common grounds now have less than 0.100 ohms resistance, before it was 2.5 to 4 ohms.

I assume you are referring to the panels under the seat?
 

Steven

Member
I've hit the kill switch while moving and when I pressed it again, everything came back on line like nothing had happened. The one thing I didn't do was slow the bike down so that the speed required a lower gear, so it didn't really prove anything. I'll do that just to satisfy my curiosity. In any case, ponydrvr has provided a solution. Now if I could only find all the ground points I can check things out, it certainly wouldn't hurt. Maybe next year when I change my fork oil.
 

Steven

Member
An electrical connection or electrical power issue has always been a common theme lurking in the background of all the discussions I have read on this issue. This thread is by far the most revealing because the incident happened to someone who had the knowledge and experience to trouble shoot the problem on the spot. In many of the threads on this subject, the owner took the bike to the dealer for repair and days later the dealer was able to start the bike right up and couldn't find any problems with anything? How would time correct a resistance issue?

I assume you are referring to the panels under the seat?

Intermittent problems are the worse. Recently, my Honda car had a problem of dying while driving down the road. It started right back up, but ran radically and then died again. Then all of a sudden it ran right again. The next day it didn't die, but idled poorly, but since then, everything has been good. I don't drive my car much (about 500 miles a year), that may be part of the problem. I just don't know. I'm waiting for an error code to pop up so that might shed some light on it. There's no point of having it checked out professionally if it's running right. My last Honda wouldn't start once but did after multiple attempts. It never happened again and I drove it for ten years after that. I've only owned two cars (both Honda's) in the last 30 years, the last one rusted out, but the engine was fine, the one I have now should be around till I bite the bullet.
 
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Steven

Member
Okay, just came back from a short ride and I tried what I said I would... Hitting the kill switch while moving. It seems that when you do it, the motor stops running but doesn't shut down completely for a few seconds. Once I slowed down the engine shut down completely and the oil light came on. Once stopped the engine started right back up and I could hear the gears changing to a lower gear. I was only in third gear when I hit the switch. This is different behavior than what previously happened when I closed the kill switch before the engine shut down completely, at that time it started right back up without doing anything and I kept going. I'll do it again sometime to make sure I didn't make a mistake.

BTW, it's in the middle 60's windy and a beautiful day.
 

ponydrvr

Member
I have been on the road when the kill switch was accidentally engaged. (lets not get into how lol). I was able to reset the the kill switch, turn the key off and back on, and the bike restarted with no problem. I was able to do this while still rolling...

Jim.....

I've done that myself a time or two. It is always a surprise when it happens. At least now it is the first thing I check while riding.
 

randy1149

New member
A tip to test ground leads. Using an ohm meter is not the best and most accurate way to do it. Measuring ohms down to 2 or3 is on the less accurate range of the meter... unless you got a $300 Fluke.

The best and most accurate way is called the IR drop method. IR meaning current X [R] range or voltage drop. Place your meter in lower volt range and place the probes across the ground lead your testing. Start the bike and read the voltage on the meter. Any volts over .2 volts is questionable.

There are many many how too IR drops, just google voltage drop testing.
 

ponydrvr

Member
... unless you got a $300 Fluke.

It is a lab grade Fluke. About 7 years old and cost well north of $300. And I agree with your test method as a good way to test for normal voltmeters. The only requirement is for the power system to be active and mine was not due to the ECU lockout
 
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randy1149

New member
It is a lab grade Fluke. About 7 years old and cost well north of $300. And I agree with your test method as a good way to test for normal voltmeters. The only requirement is for the power system to be active and mine was not due to the ECU lockout

I was not questioning your use of ohms, i can understand why as you have a very expensive meter. Most of us do not and IR drop is by far the most accurate even with very inexpensive volt meters.
 

ponydrvr

Member
UPDATE ......... UPDATE

The CTX has developed an unusual clunking noise while riding. This is not the clunk of normal gear change. I am getting LOUD clunks multiple times between shifts under acceleration and also when decelerating. I have been through the service manual troubleshooting process and haven't resolved the issue so now it is at the dealer. Not highly confident they will resolve it soon unless a corporate service tech is brought into assist. They simply haven't seen any problems with the DCT's. I don't like to be first for anything except a foot race.
 
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