Future of the N model

Woodswoman

Member
Went to the International Motorcycle Show in New York City on Friday.

Honda had a fully-faired CTX700 on display, but not a naked model. So I asked one of the Honda reps about it.

He told me that Honda won't be producing the N model for 2017. "There are plenty still on the market," he said. I asked whether this means that the plug will be entirely pulled on the naked, and the guy said no, Honda might produce it again next year.

We shall see.
 

ofdave

Member
At least he said something. The Honda guy at the AIM Expo had no clue.
And DCT only in the US says a lot.
I don't think the N has held up against the Bolt or the Vulcan S in the market place.
The leftover Ns are selling really inexpensively which has destroyed the used market for them.
My '14 N with 12000 miles might be worth 2200 wholesale with new leftovers selling for 3900 bucks. Sure couldn't get 3 retail, I bet.
The DCT surprised Honda I think. I look for it to be on the Wing and some variation of the 500 next year. The 500 has similar performance to the CTX and the new bobber model will likely do well. Wish the CTX had gotten the same attention.
Did about 110 mi. this morning and it was a nice ride. I like mine more than any bike I've had except for the Valkyrie and the R1200C.
More should give them a try-it does what you need and more.
 

Woodswoman

Member
IMO, if Honda wanted to sell more of the Nakeds, it should offer an OEM windshield kit for the model.

Personally, I don't sweat resale value a lot, not least because I have no plans to part with Flicker. The bike only cost me 7 grand to begin with.

The only motorcycles which hold their value worth a hoot are Harleys and BMWs. Example: I paid $16,000 for my Victory, and when I sold it 4 years later, with $1,500 worth of upgrades and only 8,000 on the odometer, I couldn't get $10,000 out of it.
 

Shanghai Dan

New member
Personally, if it was me, I'd do the following:

Make the CTX700 a naked-only version. Make it MORE naked. More like the Bolt, or the Fury. Then make a CTX1000 that uses the powerplant from the Africa Twin, and make THAT fully faired. It's a mid-sized cruiser that would benefit from a bigger engine. Don't try to make one platform into two fundamentally different bikes - make them unique!

It also means you have a street AND adventure version of a 700cc drive train as well as a street AND adventure version of a 1000cc DCT drive train.
 

randy1149

New member
It would take more than a 1Kcc engine to trade in a new CTX/DCT for me. Self cancelling & belt drive for a starter. I wouldn't trade up to a 1Kcc CTX with no additional upgrades, it isn't justifiable for an extra 300cc.
 
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casper

New member
Oh, I suspect if they did redo the C in a 1 liter it would have the shaft drive from the vfr1200x. I don't know why they just don't put self cancelling in the first place to highlight safety. It's not that much more expensive. But given honda has nothing in a touring bike between the 700 and the fb6 I do think they'll fill that niche.
 

Steven

Member
This is going to be long, sorry about that but I'll break it up so it's easier to read... Also, I'm going to express my views on the CTX and then get to the subject that you folks are speaking about.

First off, and I'm only speaking for myself, what makes the CTX the best bike for me is the DCT. It makes riding, especially in traffic and in town, effortless compared to a manual transmission.

Power:

It needs more! From a stop light I couldn't ask for much more. It easily accelerates me to the posted speed limit quicker than the the traffic around me and it's in the right gear when it gets there. As an added benefit, I'm already down the road before a bike next to me is still letting out their clutch. Granted a faster bike can beat me but the difference is that they have to make a conscience effort to do so whereas with the DCT, it's effortless.

Where the CTX lacks power is when it's in a higher gear at a lower rpm and also at higher speeds when I need to accelerate quickly. All the bikes before the CTX could easily accelerate in top gear with no effort. However, with the CTX I sometimes have to downshift to get the acceleration I want and even then I am wanting more. It's not that the CTX won't go fast enough, it's only that I have to wait a little longer to get to the speed I want. It that regard, a more powerful bike takes less effort to ride.

Handling:

Surprisingly the CTX isn't much lighter that my previous bikes, excluding my 1100cc and even that one isn't that much heavier. With it's low center of gravity, rake and trail, and smaller wheels, the CTX handles like a much smaller bike. Because of that it's much easier to ride in town and takes much less effort to to change direction when negotiating curves. There are down sides... First, side winds have a greater effect on the bike, fortunately it's only minimal in comparison and not a real concern. Compared to a 250cc I used to own, it's rock solid. Secondly, at higher speeds it's not as steadfast going in a straight line as a bike with a more pronounced rake and trail. All this really means is that I have to pay more attention to my direction. So, what makes this bike so great to ride in town also makes it tend to wander a little more at higher speeds, It's not really that big of a deal, but when going from a slower steering bike to this one, it's very noticeable.

As for the CTX itself and how to improve it, I'm going to speak in generalities.

Suspension:

Honda made it with a one size fits all mentality. That is wrong anyway you look at it. At it's rated load capacity, the suspension is all used up and the rider is in essence riding with no suspension. This is true even if sag of the rear shock is adjusted to it's maximum. For lighter riders, this isn't an issue. To make matters even worse, adjusting the shock is extremely difficult as it's tucked away in the frame with very little access. The front forks have no adjustments so at the load capacity of the bike it's like having a solid front end. This is very shoddy engineering. If Honda wants to claim a load capacity they need to supply a suspension that can handle it and make it adjustable for every weight in that range. This needs to be true for every motorcycle made.

DCT:

It needs at least one more setting. Sometimes Drive mode is too much in one direction and Sports mode is too much in the other. Something in between would be nice. Also, even in Manual mode it needs to upshift when it reaches redline instead of hitting the rev limiter.

Maintenance:

It's easy enough, but (and it's a big but) getting access to the valves and air filter is ridiculous especially on the fared version. This applies to all bikes with plastic.

Seat:

It's a decent seat compared to many bikes I tried but for me, only for shorter distances, about 100 miles max without getting off from time to time. Of course it depends on the rider, but in general it could be much better. It really wouldn't be that hard or expensive for Honda to make it a much better seat. I can ride all day, it's just that I can't ride non stop all day.

Chain drive:

This is another issue that haunts it's owners. There is no reason why it can't be a shaft drive, except for the price and I'm sure many folks would pay the difference. Having a chain means that it must be maintained and changed. This isn't something that most owners want to deal with. This was almost a deal breaker when I bought mine.

Fairing (faired version):

First off that little windshield that comes stock with it is useless. The tall one is better, but still isn't enough for taller/wider riders. While the Cee Bailey shield is much better, even with the bikes fairing, it still isn't as good as the handlebar mounted shields I used to have on my other bikes, but I'm splitting hairs. It still looks good and is much better than not having a fairing and shield (IMO). For those that like to tour, real wind and rain protection (top to bottom) would go a long way at making it a better bike.

What else?:

What many of us have done to our bikes - shields, running boards, seats, and things like that is a good indicator of what needs to be improved. I would also include a real cruise control.

Almost everything I've said about the bike has been negative, but even after that there isn't a bike I would prefer to ride. There are things about other bikes that I really like better, but as a whole, the CTX DCT is my cup of tea.

As for the N version, Honda really needs to keep it because some people prefer it.

I'm sure all of you folks know I'm preaching to the choir. Sorry!
 
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randy1149

New member
Steve you should be writing for a MC Mag. You hit every nail on the head Honda did NOT do to make the bike even better. The question becomes why? That's the question that becomes subjective among us all.

It just seems to me the demographic market, they where marketing to the younger beginning riders with a limited budget... not the "geriatric angels" a lot of which we seem to fit into... some of us can fart dust. I'm guessing our type of owners became a complete surprise. The newbies don't have a clue of center stands, chain vs. belts, self cancel what? It's a nice light bike they can ride and control very easy at their level of experience. And of course all those things missing brings the price down to beginners "budget".

Again your post is as good as any one I've ever red... great job.
 
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Steven

Member
Thanks Randy. You're right about Honda's target demographic, they don't seem to realize that more mature folks are drawn to this bike too.
 

casper

New member
That was a great write up steven! Hit the points, high and low, of my feelings on the C. Especially a maybe drive 2 option, or an auto drop in gears when it senses too much of a load for the gear it's in and the throttle position. The engine is just a tad too small to get it into that performance arc of the dct. But like you, having said that, the C is the bike I'd naturally go to almost all the time. If though the did do a1000 dct and a shaft, can you imagine how they'd kill the market for about 4 years as everybody else scrambled? I'd sell my 15 in a heartbeat if I knew I was getting close to the same bike yet better. But if they don't im still a very happy guy.

Randy you cracked me up about farting dust! Thanks for the laugh!!! And you're right, they don't seem to grasp that older riders are buying this one as a new bike for all the reasons older riders need in a bike. I don't get it either. It's like all marketers want to do is believe the 35 to 40 year old accountant gets to put on a bikers costume once a week and plays at it. Either a supersport contestant or a heck's angels wannabee. You read tgat right. Heck's. Couldn't even make it to the big leagues type of rider that they're going after. :)
 
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